Gajim - 2023-10-09

There's no encrypted file transfer on gajim? that sucks

what we were talking about is jingle based peer-to-peer file transfer. That doesn't necessarily mean http file uploads aren't encrypted. In fact, the xep I linked is a draft that was never accepted for some reason.

chud: yes jingle ft is something we want

But it's in the same state as audio calls

And yes other apps support it

PMR: http upload transfers _are encrypted_ if you use omemo

they're not encrypted with omemo tho

you know you are talking to developer right? So they know what they are talking about

wym

i was adding to

not correcting

it's pretty useful http file encryption is separate from omemo i think its helpful to make that distinction

chud: Jingle is crucial for exchanging extremely large files, I suppose. Skype was highly criticized when it migrated from P2P file transfers to HTTP file uploads with a file size limit (and also, P2P transfers are realtime, so one party does not need to wait for other party to end uploading to start downloading). This task can be handled with other tools, like torrents, but why introduce complications for the users?

The rise of IPv6 makes P2P viable again.

And TOR is not just a privacy tool, it's also a great way to establish "direct" connections between two parties even behind NATs by running a hidden service (even though it's totally not direct actually).

Same for I2P and Yggdrasil.

In early 90s, people still published their home addresses and phone numbers freely for mailing, what is the source of this obsession with leaking an IP address lol?

> chud: Jingle is crucial for exchanging extremely large files, I suppose. Skype was highly criticized when it migrated from P2P file transfers to HTTP file uploads with a file size limit (and also, P2P transfers are realtime, so one party does not need to wait for other party to end uploading to start downloading). This task can be handled with other tools, like torrents, but why introduce complications for the users? Torrent integration in xmpp clients when ↺

Torrent can be seen as a multi user jingle file transfer

Yup, and AceStream integration to provide a Cytube-like experience in Jabber.

Definitely better than whiteboards over XMPP or chess over XMPP.

bodqhrohro, why better?

Link Mauve: in terms of mass usage only lol.

Chess can be sent over any medium easily.

So XMPP does not pose a major benefit there.

Xmpp server admins will not appreciate their servers being used as torrent trackers

Why that?

Same reason that with drug spam?

jabber.kiev.ua was closed finally because of that, now I know no alive Ukrainian XMPP servers anymore.

Philipp Hörist pushed 1 commit to branch _refs/heads/master_ of _gajim_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim >: *98adc823* < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim/-/commit/98adc823eba1a42874926edbc496ca0e56249097 > new: Allow Gajim to be installed in editable mode

Test

Ho, it work. Last time, I didn't see my own message on this room.

The workspace feature of Gajim is very useful to group chat-room and contacts by communities. I love it. Thank everyone for your great work.

Do you know if it's planned to keep the name "workspace" ?

seb: How would you rather call it?

meson, I don't know. The word "workspace" give the filling "it's for working".

In my case, I use it to group by communities, group of friend and family.

For friends and family, the usage is more close to the old "group" feature, in the contact list.

For communities, my usage is more close to what you have on Discord

General discussions about this feature call it "spaces"

"Space" is a good name. It can apply to a lot of usage, I like it. :)

As I dislike the ergonomic of Discord, the discoverability of a community (called server by Discord) and its multiple chat-rooms is very nice. You click on one link, you join one community and you automatically see all its chat-room. Without the need to add all of them manually.

Do you know if something similar is planned for XMPP ?

I know we already have discoverability of chat-room in XMPP. But you need to add each of theme manually to you app. And if a community is splitted in multiple chat-room, adding each manually could be quickly annoying.

It could be mixed with spaces.

Something like "public space". Each public space have a name, a unique URL, an image, a list of owners, administrators and moderators. Each "public space" group a list of MUC or MIX and maybe pubsub publications to do announcements.

Yeah spaces has been talked a lot. It needs somebody to sit down and write the xep

Plus implement it in two clients as reference implementation

> You click on one link, you join one community and you automatically see all its chat-room. Without the need to add all of them manually. > > Do you know if something similar is planned for XMPP ? I brought that up a few weeks ago in the jdev room: xmpp:jdev@muc.xmpp.org?join If you scroll up to Sep 3rd you can see the answers :)

> yeah. basically client side collections you can share with a uri. the idea was that a person has a group with groupchats they have created and then they decide to publish/share it. for that they put the list somewhere on the server (probably pep) and make it publicly visible. and then can share it as a xmpp link that anybody can subscribe to it and copy it on their client. > > the subscribe could be optional

> I brought that up a few weeks ago in the jdev room: xmpp:jdev@muc.xmpp.org?join What is jdev ? Jabber Devel ?

Right

Yeah

I got an error when I tried to join the room

Maybe this is because of my server

There is also xmpp:future@joinjabber.org?join For xmpp platform development. Jdev is for developing clients actually

> > yeah. basically client side collections you can share with a uri. the idea was that a person has a group with groupchats they have created and then they decide to publish/share it. for that they put the list somewhere on the server (probably pep) and make it publicly visible. and then can share it as a xmpp link that anybody can subscribe to it and copy it on their client. > > > > the subscribe could be optional Excellent idea. The important is easy of use >

seb: this was MSavoritias (fae,ve)'s idea btw ;)

Actually Kris idea i think. Not to steal credit ^^ We were talking in the platform room. But i did brought it up in the jdev room

Should I try to not interfere with jingle file transfers or screw that since it's apparently broken anyway?

MSavoritias (fae,ve): yeah, but the idea is not particularly novel. Basically pep native bookmarks work like that already to share your bookmarks between clients on the same account.

Which is what makes it so smart imo. Because the pieces are already there for the most part

Hello, If I leave a channel using another client (Conversations, Dino, Movim), all the other joined clients also leave it, except for Gajim. Is this known?

Oh, never mind: https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim/-/issues/11288

chud, would be fine by me

but its hard to judge without seeing any code

in any case i would opt for delvering something, instead of trying to fix many things at once