Gajim - 2018-02-20


  1. SABer sounds good (Y) >“Send file directly” with disclaimer that you give away your IP :D
  2. lovetox we have that, but only for contacts who are not in your roster
  3. Link Mauve SABer, and the disclaimer that you do so when your HTTP Upload service points you to a random HTTP server too? :p
  4. Link Mauve As well as your content.
  5. lovetox have to go to bed, night
  6. SABer sure :)
  7. SABer night
  8. SABer is it a random server?
  9. Link Mauve It can be.
  10. Link Mauve It can also change at each slot you request.
  11. SABer ahh ok
  12. SABer thought it is the server of your jabber account
  13. SABer only
  14. Link Mauve So if your server wants to give your IP or secret picture to a third party, it can do so in a way that can be almost impossible to detect.
  15. Link Mauve Not necessarily, your Jabber server is the one giving you a slot, but said slot can be on a totally different server.
  16. Link Mauve I’ve seen people at xsf@ discussing about giving those directly to Amazon for example.
  17. SABer ok not cool
  18. jjrh To be fair your XMPP server can do whatever they want.
  19. Link Mauve Yup, of course.
  20. Link Mauve That’s why I will never stop to host my own.
  21. jjrh Which is why XMPP / federation is so cool and important.
  22. jjrh And also why omemo and other encryption schemes are important.
  23. Link Mauve Less true, a server can block those at will.
  24. Link Mauve And they’re quite unreliable so it would be understandable to downgrade to plain text if the communication is failing.
  25. jjrh Yeah - I tried omemo and found it was inconvenient enough that I turned it off.
  26. Link Mauve Most people would react to a “sorry, disable omemo, I have an issue with my client” message by disabling omemo, that’s something a server can totally do. :)
  27. Link Mauve So, mostly don’t trust untrusted third parties and everything’ll be fine.
  28. jjrh The main issue was that people who used conversations have omemo /just work/ but then find out all the messages on their desktop client which doesn't have omemo don't work
  29. SABer >... important true words !
  30. jjrh Has anyone implemented XEP 0174?
  31. Link Mauve Gajim for instance.
  32. jjrh Really? today I learned heh
  33. SABer no omemo client on macos sucks :/
  34. Link Mauve jjrh, you need Avahi and python-dbus installed for it to work, see Help > Features.
  35. SABer tried pidgin omemo but it is unusable
  36. Link Mauve It’s called Bonjour / Zeroconf there.
  37. Link Mauve SABer, Gajim should work.
  38. jjrh ahh okay.
  39. Link Mauve SABer, Dino too.
  40. jjrh Link Mauve, do you know of any folks who have tried to use it with any amount of success? Like at a conference?
  41. Link Mauve lovetox, btw this feature should be renamed to something like “Serverless messaging”, Bonjour just means nothing to most users.
  42. SABer but you have to compile youself ?
  43. Link Mauve jjrh, I have used it at various places, yeah.
  44. Link Mauve SABer, Gajim is pure Python, it doesn’t need to be compiled.
  45. Link Mauve Dino, yes until they provide a binary on the Apple store.
  46. jjrh It would be pretty neat to see a conference or big event like a music festival push xep 0174 - looks like conversations doesn't have it unfortunately.
  47. jjrh That's where I could see it being really fun/useful
  48. SABer i dont use the crapple store
  49. SABer pure python and omemo and dependencies, too?
  50. SABer so somebody should make a drag and drop app for macos
  51. SABer standalone
  52. SABer mac users need that
  53. SABer :)
  54. SABer sometime
  55. SABer eventually
  56. Link Mauve SABer, yeah right, if only some mac user would step up and offer to maintain it.
  57. SABer but very important for the future of the XMPP ecosystem IMO !!!!!!!!!!
  58. jjrh I don't know much about OSX but couldn't you just include it as a dependency as part of the package?
  59. Link Mauve SABer, oh great, that means you’re offering to do that?
  60. SABer you would because it is important but i'm just a stupid user :/
  61. jjrh https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim-plugins/wikis/OmemoGajimPlugin SABer
  62. Link Mauve SABer, arf, but then I need someone to offer me a mac.
  63. Link Mauve I run Linux, it would be quite hard for me to make such a package and test it otherwise.
  64. SABer hmmm you need xcode running on a macosx server because that yould be started in a VM
  65. Link Mauve So you’re offering me a macosx server? Great!
  66. Link Mauve It could be even cheaper for you to just learn how to make such a package, though. ^^
  67. SABer i know some mac devs but i guess they are bussy for the next X month
  68. Link Mauve Why don’t you become one then? :p
  69. SABer too stupid
  70. Link Mauve I’m pretty sure you’re not.
  71. SABer >offering me a macosx server? the server version of macosx could be started in a VM
  72. Link Mauve At least on Linux, it’s quite trivial to make a package for e.g. ArchLinux.
  73. SABer normal macosx doesent run in a VM
  74. Link Mauve SABer, but that would be illegal, according to the EULA of this OS.
  75. SABer server is legal ;)
  76. Link Mauve The VM itself has to run on an Apple PC.
  77. Link Mauve (IIRC.)
  78. SABer ahh ok
  79. SABer dosent matter :D
  80. jjrh If you setup OMemo on osx SABer keep some notes :)
  81. jjrh How does gajim omemo work on windows Link Mauve ? Docs just say you install the plugin and you're good to go
  82. Link Mauve jjrh, IIRC they bundle a bunch of Python extensions, so that all plugins you may want to install can find them.
  83. Link Mauve And that’s why the installer is that huge.
  84. jjrh Yeah that's what I guessed.
  85. SABer would this work?
  86. SABer https://py2app.readthedocs.io/en/latest/
  87. jjrh that's probably the way to go
  88. jjrh gajim doesn't even have a OSX package
  89. Link Mauve Note that you will also need to figure out how to include the dependencies such as GTK+.
  90. jjrh that's probably the real pain
  91. SABer i'm lost :-(
  92. SABer n8
  93. lovetox jjrh, not a package, but also not hard to install, we have a wiki manual for mac osx users
  94. lovetox i guess it would be not too hard to do a brew package that fuses the steps on the wiki into one command
  95. ivucica so uh, is support for XEP-0078 (non-sasl auth) gone?
  96. ivucica might be something else
  97. ivucica nonetheless i am getting "could not connect to" even though i see the server replying, i just don't have SASL in the server :)
  98. ivucica i also symlinked ~/.local/share/gajim/plugins/plugin_installer to point to $GITROOT/gajim-plugins/plugin_installer, but i don't see it showing up in the plugins list
  99. ivucica git describe sayeth gajim-1.0.0-beta1-26-g64d743de3
  100. lovetox did you restart gajim?
  101. ivucica i >started< it :) but actually the issue might be that i, uh, sorta didn't realize that i had the old gajim-plugins from 2016. mercurial. :)
  102. ivucica still, old-style auth, it's gone?
  103. lovetox no its still in our xmpp lib
  104. lovetox only that no one tried it for years
  105. lovetox where do you even find a server that has no SASL
  106. lovetox if you make me an account on the server i can debug whats the problem
  107. ivucica *cough* it's a new thing :)
  108. ivucica writing it
  109. ivucica it's literally not implemented yet
  110. ivucica it must be something else, i just added stub response of <mechanisms ...>, no good
  111. ivucica maybe it doesn't like no-startssl-being-offered
  112. lovetox hm we support start tls and direct tls
  113. lovetox but for direct you need dns records set accordingly
  114. lovetox maybe for testing you should connect plain
  115. lovetox there is a config switch for that
  116. lovetox in the advanced config
  117. ivucica again, normal c2s port doesn't have starttls because i haven't implemented it
  118. ivucica i see only 'warn if insecure'
  119. lovetox no there is another one
  120. lovetox wait
  121. ivucica *shrug* i'm staring at the settings right now :) mind you, not the advanced configuration, but the regular UI
  122. ivucica admittedly, it is an odd setup anyway and i'm only asking because i like gajim's xml console.
  123. lovetox allow_plaintext_connection
  124. lovetox advanced -> advanced config editor
  125. ivucica ok, now i get asked to permit this
  126. ivucica uh, why do we even have that second knob? :)
  127. ivucica i even got two warnings
  128. lovetox and you could run gajim with -v so you get log output
  129. lovetox one is for warning, one is to even allow it
  130. ivucica *nod*
  131. ivucica alright, it's stuck now, i guess it doesn't like the offered methods
  132. ivucica s/methods/"this is the stuff you need to provide"
  133. lovetox hard to tell without debug output
  134. ivucica i'll play with this further
  135. ivucica yeah, no worries, i am not supposed to be playing with this at this time anyway
  136. ivucica :)
  137. ivucica i'll come back some time in the future
  138. ivucica the version i had before updating seemed to be trying to connect to the default port at 5222 ignoring the SRV record pointing at the toy server's port, but this seems to work now
  139. lovetox just start gajim with -v
  140. lovetox what dns querys are made and what the result was, you can also see in the debug log
  141. ivucica *nod* will do
  142. Bart https://conference.gajim.org:5281/pastebin/ea2d3253-1ddf-422f-86e0-03595e50f03b
  143. lovetox so it also doesnt work with conversations?
  144. Bart Nope, it doesn't.
  145. Bart I realize that this probably isn't a Gajim-only thing, more an XMPP/OMEMO thing. But I'm not sure who else to ask anymore. The Conversations people said I should ask you guys.
  146. lovetox haha :D
  147. Bart I think I would have a good laugh at my expense too it I were in you position right now. But since I am in my position, I just want to get past this...
  148. lovetox start with telling your contact to update conversations to the latest version
  149. lovetox oh you wrote it already is
  150. Bart Indeed I did!
  151. lovetox hm, right now i cant do much, when im at home i can test if the server does the correct thing
  152. lovetox you say she also cant write you ?
  153. lovetox the problem seems to be that we cant get the keys from the server
  154. lovetox she could also try to disable her account in conversations, and reactivate it again, that should also trigger publishing the keys again to the server
  155. lovetox on what server are you?
  156. Bart We can chat, just not using OMEMO. She sent me a few screenshots (using Threema). There I could see, that she had OMEMO activated and that she sent me a few messages. None of them reached me.
  157. Bart I am on pad7.de for this contact (jabjab.de is the main domain).
  158. lovetox hm do you know how to see your own fingerprint?
  159. lovetox ask her if she sees this fingerprint in your contact details in conversations
  160. lovetox and tell her to check if it is trusted if she sees it
  161. Bart She screenshot showed my fingerprints. And they are activated and correct. Conversations trusts new fingerprints blindly by default. It just complains once these are changed.
  162. lovetox hm k thats good
  163. lovetox so tell her to disable her account in conversations and reactivate it
  164. lovetox best while you are also online
  165. lovetox then try to send her a message
  166. Bart There is an option in Conversations to create and publish new OMEMO keys. I could tell her to try that.
  167. lovetox i would only do that as a last resort
  168. lovetox first i would try the disable/enable thing
  169. Bart I'll give that a shot.
  170. Bart She's at work right now, so I can't do it right now. But we can try this evening.
  171. bot Daniel proposed a new merge request for _gajim-plugins/master_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim-plugins/merge_requests/67 >: [clients_icons] Fix icon display in roster and gc
  172. bot Philipp Hörist closed an issue in _gajim-plugins_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim-plugins/issues/223 >: #223: < UrlImagePreview: Add `jabber:x:oob` element to outgoing messages >
  173. Daniel received private messages in muc appear twice in conversation view, does anyone know why?
  174. Daniel disabling message carbons solves this problem. any thoughts?
  175. bot Philipp Hörist pushed 2 commits to branch _refs/heads/master_ of _gajim-plugins_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim-plugins >: *bdc8b4f8* < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim-plugins/commit/bdc8b4f8dfa17348b5c54d47276cfc6859e03618 > [clients_icons] Update manifest.ini *db7c7971* < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim-plugins/commit/db7c7971f5bf11616f9536a7505b0a27bbfab410 > [clients_icons] Fix icon display in roster and gc
  176. bot Philipp Hörist merged a merge request for _gajim-plugins/master_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim-plugins/merge_requests/67 >: [clients_icons] Fix icon display in roster and gc
  177. lovetox Daniel, hm im sure i fixed this once, sad to see it again pop up
  178. lovetox have to look into it
  179. bot Daniel updated a merge request for _gajim-plugins/master_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim-plugins/merge_requests/61 >: [set_location] Fix crash on reopen config window
  180. Daniel lovetox, I have xml logs if you need them
  181. Tschaeggaer Hey there. Is it possible that Gajim 1.0-beta2 doesn't (re)store the window position. That is when I open and close gajim, the window is somewhere else...on Windows.
  182. lovetox no i can reproduce it
  183. lovetox Tschaeggaer, you are talking across restarts
  184. lovetox or without restart
  185. Tschaeggaer yep, restarting.
  186. Tschaeggaer yes, restarting.
  187. Tschaeggaer woops, sorry.
  188. Tschaeggaer Gajim stable did it, storing the window position correctly.
  189. lovetox works fine for me with the roster window
  190. lovetox in what window mode do you try this?
  191. bot Philipp Hörist pushed 2 commits to branch _refs/heads/master_ of _gajim_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim >: https://conference.gajim.org:5281/pastebin/c3c32320-8b41-40cc-a2cb-28031e228640
  192. bot Daniel updated a merge request for _gajim-plugins/master_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim-plugins/merge_requests/61 >: [set_location] Fix crash on reopen config window
  193. Tschaeggaer 1 window for all
  194. lovetox hm tested it now multiple times
  195. lovetox works for me
  196. lovetox how do you quit gajim?
  197. lovetox with the quit menu?
  198. lovetox there is a advanced config setting
  199. lovetox save-roster-position
  200. lovetox check if its activated
  201. Daniel how can I contribute to the wiki?
  202. Tschaeggaer it is activated
  203. Tschaeggaer doesnt matter if gajim menu -> quit or via tray right-click quit
  204. bot Philipp Hörist updated a merge request for _gajim-plugins/master_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim-plugins/merge_requests/61 >: [set_location] Fix crash on reopen config window
  205. bot Philipp Hörist pushed 3 commits to branch _refs/heads/master_ of _gajim-plugins_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim-plugins >: https://conference.gajim.org:5281/pastebin/837e9f3b-3a55-4525-9569-3c2208d9548f
  206. bot Philipp Hörist closed an issue in _gajim-plugins_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim-plugins/issues/265 >: #265: < [set_location] Opening configuration window crashes Gajim >
  207. bot Philipp Hörist merged a merge request for _gajim-plugins/master_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim-plugins/merge_requests/61 >: [set_location] Fix crash on reopen config window
  208. Tschaeggaer when I detach the roster with tabbed chats, then it "almost" stores it. except the height is like 100px less than before
  209. Tschaeggaer which are missing at the bottom of the gajim window
  210. Tschaeggaer it is working / storing correctly when i have just 1 monitor activated instead of 2.
  211. lovetox yeah with 2 monitors it gets a bit complicated