Gajim - 2018-01-31


  1. andy lovetox, I think that U can also change how muc user list is showing up. For example Dino show it in this way:
  2. andy https://share.czerniak.info.pl/andrzej/U9LCOQmgYu1Fa6Jk/Screenshot_20180131_052854.png
  3. andy btw, it would be possible to theme Gajim?
  4. rozzin This may seem like a weird request..., but I'm trying to modify gajim so that it shows the JID resource in conversations; I'm I'm new to both the gajim codebase and the nbxmpp library, and am having trouble figuring out where I should even be looking. Pointers?
  5. rom1dep > lovetox, I think that U can also change how muc user list is showing up. For example Dino show it in this way: I don't see why it would be better that way. Makes no sense ux-wise
  6. pitchum a search filter in muc user list would be a good thing though
  7. lovetox there is a search filter in muc user list pitchum
  8. lovetox just type on your keyboard
  9. pitchum yeah, I've just noticed, but it's not as good as the one that exists for the roster
  10. lovetox its not a filter exactly
  11. pitchum it doesn't really filter, it jumps to the result
  12. lovetox it just selects
  13. pitchum yes
  14. pitchum the roster search filter is good
  15. bot Daniel updated a merge request for _gajim/master_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim/merge_requests/202 >: Add navigation for chat history
  16. louiz’ indeed lovetox
  17. wiktor Hello, I just updated to 1.0.0-alpha and Gajim looks *very* good and modern now. I noticed that there is no ThemeSwitcher plugin now, did it disappear in the mean time? (I'd like to experiment with GTK themes and I'm on Windows). Thanks in advance for information!
  18. wiktor Oh, I found a way to switch the theme (through etc/gtk-3.0/settings.xml, gtk-theme-name key) but it doesn't look correct, back to default Gajim theme :)
  19. SaltyBones Okay, recently somebody said everything is in place to not miss MUC messages while offline. Does gajim not have those things or do I need to set something up differently?
  20. rom1dep SaltyBones: you need your server to support MAM. Then it works, but the backlog experience isn't great, you don't have a clear separation between the old history and the new one, sometimes you end up with no context at all, you have no indication that messages are or aren't still being fetched, and you would end up too often juggling between the history window and the discussion just in order to follow a thread
  21. SaltyBones rom1dep, so basically gajim doesn't really support it...?
  22. bot Hoeze created an issue in _gajim_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim/issues/8879 >: #8879: < Flatpak-Image for Flathub.org >
  23. bot Philipp Hörist closed an issue in _gajim-plugins_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim-plugins/issues/247 >: #247: < FR: Share image from clipboard >
  24. bot Philipp Hörist modified an issue in _gajim_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim/issues/8879 >: #8879: < Flatpak-Image for Flathub.org >
  25. rom1dep SaltyBones: depends on your definition of it. At least the offline MUC messages end-up in your client and become searchable if the MUC supports MAM, I don't think there is a single client that does the right thing UX-wise (not even conversations)
  26. SaltyBones So, does this room support MAM? :)
  27. wiktor for me MAM in Gajim had two problems - messages are not sorted in time order and if I open a chat window then even if MAM is synced in the background I won't see it in the window (chat window not refreshed after MAM sync)
  28. wiktor SaltyBones: Conversations says it does :)
  29. SaltyBones So if this room supports MAM I should be able to see all messages in my history, right?
  30. SaltyBones Because I have been in here for ages...
  31. SaltyBones Alright, I have compared the history with the logs on the website and it seems to work.
  32. SaltyBones I am amazed by how this is obfuscated by the UI to the point where I thought it didn't exist.
  33. SaltyBones I guess that was you point, wiktor ? :)
  34. wiktor SaltyBones: Yes :) Especially if you open chat window quickly you'll never see your synced history there, for me it was weird. (But I understand it's just not implemented)
  35. SaltyBones And you instead see the automatic replay of previous messages which of course really don't go back that far....
  36. wiktor Ah yes, and that makes you double confused.
  37. rom1dep yeah, it'd be so little to do and so useful to have some subtle animation indicating that MAM fetching is going on
  38. SaltyBones mam fetching?
  39. wiktor I'm not so sure about "so little to do" (everything always seems simpler than it is), but I agree it would be very nice :)
  40. SaltyBones but the messages from mam are not shown in the chat window anyway
  41. wiktor I guess rom1dep means showing they are being fetched and then displaying them in order
  42. rom1dep wiktor: the client should always know that it's in the process of downloading history, it should be possible to add an animation such as https://icons8.com/preloaders/en/horizontal/thin-stripes/ at the edge of the message window to indicate that stuff is being populated :)
  43. SaltyBones rom1dep, but my point is even after downloading the message window is never populate with stuff from mam in gajim ;)
  44. wiktor rom1dep: I guess Gajim knows it's syncing but displaying the spinner is you know, a new feature, and features by default are not implemented :)
  45. rom1dep Yeah, I mean that in the hard roadmap towards having full MAM support, that's an easy hop
  46. lovetox SaltyBones, MAM message are displayed in MUCs inside the chatwindow when we fetch them
  47. lovetox as for single chat, yes a valid feature request to load history inside the chatwindow but
  48. lovetox you can never "miss" a message
  49. lovetox MAM messages in single chat are always messages you already successful received on another device and you got a notification there about the new message
  50. lovetox so its only a sync of messages that you already received, not new messages
  51. lovetox truly new messages that were received while you are offline, are always displayed in the chatwindow
  52. lovetox so its not so confusing, you want old messages that you already read in the past, use the history window, you want to see new messages that you didnt read look at the chatwindow
  53. SaltyBones lovetox, hm...
  54. SaltyBones I am unconvinced.
  55. SaltyBones Not saying that you are wrong, just wondering why I am under that impression.
  56. lovetox i would also like to know that :)
  57. lovetox MAM is just a sync of already read messages, before MAM existed, people didnt "miss" messages
  58. lovetox the just didnt have their archived history on all devices available
  59. lovetox to display all archived messages inside the same window as new messages, is a convenience feature, that i understand
  60. lovetox but this will not let you miss more or less messages as before
  61. SaltyBones but MAM doesn't know if I have read a message, right?
  62. lovetox thats a edge case
  63. SaltyBones I don't think it is...
  64. lovetox read means in that context, you received a notification about it on another device
  65. SaltyBones Because what happens is, I have conversations and gajim
  66. SaltyBones I talk to somebody on gajim, because I mostly use that...
  67. SaltyBones Then I pack up my laptop and go home
  68. lovetox you dont have to explain the case to me
  69. lovetox im aware of it
  70. SaltyBones where I open it again and go back ot the conversation
  71. SaltyBones You claimed it was an edge case, though. :)
  72. lovetox you describe another problem
  73. lovetox this indeed is a gajim problem
  74. lovetox you let windows open across sessions
  75. nico arent those what readmarkers are designed for
  76. SaltyBones I mean, if my network connection is a session, then yes.
  77. SaltyBones I'm not sure what the xmpp definition of session is. :)
  78. lovetox yes, indeed thats a gajim problem
  79. lovetox current impl, expects no connection loss :)
  80. SaltyBones and what's the difference here now?
  81. SaltyBones I don't quite get it. :)
  82. lovetox the edge case i was talking about was
  83. lovetox you got a message on another device but didnt read it
  84. lovetox then expect your other client to show it as unread
  85. lovetox which can only be achieved with all clients in question have read markers impl
  86. SaltyBones I think I am getting more confused.
  87. SaltyBones If two clients are online and there are no read markers then both WILL show messages as unread.
  88. nico yes
  89. lovetox yeah lets leave it, i have to work, i look that mam messages are display inside the chatwindow on sync, so the connection problem case is solved
  90. lovetox i was talking about one client offline
  91. lovetox if clients are both online, there is no MAM in play
  92. SaltyBones ah
  93. SaltyBones Well, I also have to work. x)
  94. SaltyBones Sorry!
  95. horstvogel > If two clients are online and there are no read markers then both WILL show messages as unread. Read markers 🤔 you have activate this on gajim Master MS Windows? Never see a read marker in gajim
  96. rom1dep > ‎[17:05:31] ‎lovetox‎: if clients are both online, there is no MAM in play In the MUC case, MAM plays a role, no matter whether you were online or not, doesn't it?
  97. lovetox no, if you are online with multiple devices you get your messages with carbons
  98. lovetox but yes mam has a different role in muc
  99. lovetox in single chat the server sends you all messages that were sent while you were offline on connect, you dont need MAM for that
  100. lovetox afterwards you sync with MAM messages that were sent/received from other devices of yours while you were offline with this particular device
  101. lovetox in muc there is no send all offline message on connect
  102. lovetox so mam is used to get all messages since a certain date
  103. lovetox this could include messages you already saw from another device, but also new messages you never saw
  104. lovetox so in short in single chat MAM never gets messages that you didnt receive on another device already
  105. lovetox in MUC MAM it could also get messages that are new to you
  106. rom1dep yeap, that was my understanding
  107. lovetox but please lets stop talking about this, someday i will have it working so nobody has to think about this stuff anymore ^^
  108. rom1dep lovetox: please. Make gajim the first XMPP client good at handling backlogs. Merge everything in message window, put a separation bar to segregate freshly pulled form local-history messages (and a floating button to access this point in the history) and that will be pretty much ending my grief with XMPP (as opposed to the dumbest IRC client that does the above just fine)
  109. lovetox yeah im planning too :)
  110. lovetox but first the messagewindow thing
  111. lovetox then the redesign of the textwindow
  112. rom1dep 👍
  113. bot André proposed a new merge request for _gajim/master_ < https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim/merge_requests/204 >: Update flatpak file