Gajim - 2016-09-03

  1. baitisj Args show a stanza sent event and then there's probably at least 50msec for each stanza sent. really piles up after 1000 contacts; ends up being about 50 seconds.
  2. baitisj this is in gajim.c.ged
  3. baitisj Two other issues. If the server has extensive history, gajim will spend a tremendous amount of resources to synchronize it all... and it seems to take forever.
  4. baitisj Another severe performance issue seems to be involved in the initial handling gpg signatures
  5. de-facto hmm why does file transfer from Conversations to Gajim never work?
  6. de-facto it works fine from Conversations to Conversations
  7. de-facto when i accept file from Gajim it just sits there, doing nothing
  8. de-facto would i somehow need to start it other than clicking accept button and choosing location ?
  9. de-facto it woudl sit there at 0% 0B/s forever
  10. de-facto how can i get Gajim to start accepting incomming data from the file offered by the remote Conversations?
  11. de-facto do i need a plugin to client to client file transfer?
  12. de-facto i think i remember it worked from Gajim to Gajim though
  13. baitisj interesting
  14. baitisj send me a junk file, I'll try to download in gajim with the debug windo open
  15. de-facto hmm how can i send you a file in a muc?
  16. baitisj de-facto, you have to send it from a private chat window
  17. baitisj
  18. baitisj Hmm. not what I intended to do.
  19. baitisj hmm does the key next to the server in the roster imply a TLS connection?
  20. linus We should really have an obvious sign somewhere that says "USE HTTP UPLOAD TO SEND FILES"
  21. linus Or, you know, disable Jingle FT by default :)
  22. linus At least until it does more than single-end P2P
  23. zak Oh this discussion again... :-(
  24. linus yes, this discussion again
  25. linus because the current state of Jingle File Transfer in gajim is kind of crap, and has shown on multiple occasions to confuse users
  26. linus until we have a decent combination of JFT and HTTP Upload, JFT should be disabled by default because people expect it to work and it often doesn't.
  27. lovetox question is
  28. lovetox why does his conversations choose jingle over http upload
  29. linus it doesn't
  30. linus oh wait yes it does sorry
  31. linus weird, seeing as convs doesn't allow receiving JFTs
  32. linus as far as I've seen, at least
  33. lovetox maybe his server doesnt support httpupload
  34. linus yeah that's the most likely reason
  35. linus with Jingle negotiation, wouldn't it even be possible to allow HTTP File Upload-based sharing both ways even if only one of the parties has server-side HTTP Upload support?
  36. linus that is, Jingle negotiation tells the sender that the receiver has HTTP Upload, the receiver requests a file slot, then forwards the information about it to the sender who then uploads it there
  37. lovetox you could do something like this probably
  38. lovetox but this would be again working around lazy server admins
  39. lovetox and i feel xmpp has enough of this
  40. linus HTTP upload isn't just a matter of lazy server admins, it's a matter of physical resources too
  41. linus you can run an XMPP server on a raspberry pi
  42. linus but HTTP Upload can require a lot of storage (depending on user count and usage levels)
  43. linus and I'm not sure the raspberry pi can handle such bandwidth either
  44. linus same goes for a small, cheap VPS
  45. lovetox true forgot about that
  46. zak Good morning.
  47. linus morning!"
  48. zak I think there may not be lazy server admins, but other admins who just don't want their space wasted by user's files and therefore disable HTTP upload on their servers.
  49. zak So I want te stress again, that HTTP upload is not the one and only thing here, but just complements JFT.
  50. zak So I want to stress again, that HTTP upload is not the one and only thing here, but just complements JFT.
  51. linus Yes, but in its current state it's confusing to most users because HTTP Upload isn't enabled by default and JFT frequently Just Doesn't Work™
  52. Marzanna Does http upload have storage quota?
  53. linus hence, disable by default until it works better
  54. linus Marzanna, that's a matter of server configuration. Any sane multi-user config does
  55. linus zak, I fully agree that JFT is the future. But its current implementation is not good enough to be enabled by default, confusing users.
  56. zak okay, agreed.
  57. zak With the quota, user's will have again the problem that sharing files will then stop working some time (when the quota is reached). With bad implementation, they won't even know why.
  58. zak I need to start coding again some time :-/
  59. zak Did Asterix say something about the next Gajim version? I got it he was online last week.
  60. lovetox what files would stop working?
  61. lovetox if you use httpupload you download the file
  62. linus lovetox, if you use up your upload quota you can't upload any more files
  63. lovetox as long as it is on your device it never stops working
  64. linus I presume
  65. zak I mean if you want to *upload* yet another file, after quota has been reached...
  66. lovetox where does this happen?
  67. linus on any server with upload quotas for HTTP Upload
  68. lovetox i never heard of this problem
  69. lovetox then stop abusing your server
  70. linus it's not necessarily abuse
  71. lovetox if you treat whatsapp like a movie file sharing platform
  72. lovetox i guess they will do also something about it
  73. lovetox it is, i bet you cant run into an limit on any decent server
  74. lovetox try it with
  75. lovetox or
  76. linus I've used Telegram to share pictures with people, regularly, for two years now
  77. zak It's not like every jabber-server admin has endless resources. We can be happy for every small server as well.
  78. linus that's probably about 1000 photos I've shared, at least several hundred MB worht
  79. zak And as I said, most admins probably would disable HTTP upload completely because they just don't want this.
  80. lovetox and? xmpp features must cater to every small server admin?!
  81. lovetox whats the point
  82. zak And the other thing of course is, I myself don't want to use HTTP upload for personal files, which even might be bigger in size some time.
  83. linus lovetox, the point is that it's not a matter of laziness but of resource availability
  84. lovetox so how would jingle give the same confortable experience without a server in the middle?
  85. zak @lovetox: I think this is really a bad attitude. XMPP is open *because* it should cater different needs and requirements!
  86. linus exactly
  87. linus lovetox, jingle doesn't mean no intermediate server
  88. lovetox i know
  89. lovetox but if it does its basically the same
  90. zak and if I have a zip file of 100MB which I just want to transfer one single time to one single contact, I surely don't want to use HTTP upload for this
  91. lovetox then dont
  92. zak exactly
  93. lovetox im not saying http upload should be the one and only thing
  94. lovetox but you cant say jingle is the future
  95. linus it is
  96. zak I didn't
  97. lovetox only if it uses a server in the middle
  98. lovetox which would be basically the same
  99. lovetox filetransfers without server in the middle, are just bad experience between mobiles
  100. lovetox thats why it doesnt work goog
  101. lovetox good
  102. zak As I said, they complement each other: HTTP upload for sharing smaller files like pictures especially for more than one person, and JFT for one time transfers of arbitrary files.
  103. lovetox nothing will change about that as i see it, or it would have been done a long time ago
  104. zak As I said, they complement each other: HTTP upload for sharing smaller files like pictures especially with more than one person, and JFT for one time transfers of arbitrary files.
  105. linus because it's a protocol for negotiating a variety of different ways of transferring files, *be it* via HTTP Upload (server in the middle providing file storage perhaps even in the long term) *or* through P2P (for one-time, one-way transfers) or even via a carrier pigeon
  106. lovetox yeah but it is not here since yesterday
  107. lovetox its already what version 4 i believe
  108. lovetox its complicated, very few clients have it, or do it correctly
  109. lovetox and for what, for the 0.1 % users who want to transfer 1 GB files
  110. lovetox is xmpp really the right medium for transfering such files, are there not a dozen other services who do this a million times better?
  111. zak I often wanted to transfer files of several MB, but you are right it is supported really badly.
  112. zak @lovetox: like what?
  113. linus ^
  114. zak If I don't want to use an external storage of course
  115. zak like dropbox, or the like
  116. lovetox i cant tell you a service if you dont want to use a service
  117. linus the point is that it is perfectly possible and reasonable to transfer a file directly from A to B rather than having A upload it to C and then B download it from there
  118. zak Well then XMPP could have a good feature here
  119. zak lovetox: I am not saying you should implement that. I am just saying that it would be good for XMPP
  120. lovetox are there not bittorrent things that do that?
  121. linus There's no need for any service besides some sort of network connection between the two points (internet) and a way for them to know where to find each other (XMPP/Jingle)
  122. linus lovetox, bittorrent requires a tracker and is unsuitable for one-time one-way transfers
  123. lovetox im not arguing that it wouldnt be nice to have such a thing
  124. lovetox but with mobiles, unstable connections etc
  125. zak I agree, I would probably not use it on mobiles often.
  126. zak But XMPP shouldn't be focussed on mobile only
  127. lovetox so did this whole discussion not start, because de-facto wanted to jingle from convfersations to gajim :D
  128. linus Potentially controversial suggestion: while XMPP certainly should allow negotiating P2P transfers, Gajim should *not* support using it for file transfers. Instead, there should be a standalone application that does this.
  129. zak linux: Why should Gajim not support P2P transfers?
  130. linus lovetox, it started because de-facto was one of many people who have had a problem with transferring files recently because it tries to use JFT.
  131. lovetox jingle is broken i think in gajim
  132. lovetox i never use it
  133. lovetox and conversations switched to v4 i believe
  134. lovetox whatever that means
  135. lovetox i dont think they are working together anymore
  136. zak The question was not if it is broken, but if it should support it or not. Implementing a working solution is a different matter.
  137. lovetox gajim supports jingle since ages
  138. lovetox but its complicated and no one wants to look at it
  139. linus zak, because gajim is a chat program and the expectation that users have of a modern chat program is that it allows them to chat, from multiple devices, and share pictures and other media in a way that it shows up in the history on every device[citation needed].
  140. linus The failure to meet this expectation is what's stopping me from getting my family to switch from Telegram to XMPP for our family communications
  141. zak linux: then we should drop all other feature, that doesn't have to do with chatting as well?
  142. zak I think sharing a file is a common thing you do once in a while while chatting.
  143. linus Also it's linus not linux :)
  144. zak oh... sorry
  145. zak linus: then we should drop all other feature, that doesn't have to do with chatting as well?
  146. linus Yes, it's a common thing and the average user's expectation is that that file will appear across all clients and in the history.
  147. linus Hence, persistent upload.
  148. zak If it is complicated, and no one wants to work at it, that's all fine, but then abandon and remove it completely isn't the way to go I think.
  149. linus P2P should certainly be an option but I'm fairly sure it shouldn't be the default in gajim and potentially it shouldn't be in gajim at all.
  150. linus zak, so keep it unmaintained and broken? That's better than not having it?
  151. zak Well, you may have your opinion, but I disagree. I often had the need for this and was often disappointed, when it didn't work.
  152. zak Your proposal is to remove it because the feature shouldn't be there, not because it doesn't work correctly.
  153. zak Wasn't it?
  154. lovetox nah i think if httpupload would be default
  155. lovetox and jingle would be working, but was like a special option someone had to choose who knows what hes doing
  156. lovetox that would be finde
  157. linus It's removing it for both reasons. If we can get it to work again it should be a feature that's available but not activated by default because it breaks expectations of Mr Average User
  158. lovetox but right now the broken option is the default
  159. linus If we don't get it working again it should go away completely
  160. lovetox so zak make it your life goal to get jingle working again in gajim
  161. lovetox we need you man !
  162. linus lol
  163. lovetox bad linus will remove it, if you dont do something against it
  164. linus I don't have the say in that matter x)
  165. lovetox maybe in oktober when i have holiday
  166. lovetox and im really bored
  167. lovetox im looking whats the problem
  168. cippaciong Wouldn't be easier to implement a sort of "delete locally/remotely" in httpupload?
  169. cippaciong Once you are done with your 100MB zip file you delete it on your server from the client
  170. linus Yes, delete would be good
  171. linus actually I've been looking at the specs zak and I'm not sure Jingle can provide the history/multi-client capabilities?
  172. qeap tha same old mans here
  173. linus it seems to be entirely focused on a transient session between two resources.
  174. qeap no bady have a good projict
  175. zak Specs can be extended to cover this as well.
  176. linus right but they currently don't
  177. qeap i am asked haw can make tha id on may server a fhon nember like whats app
  178. lovetox you want to call people from gajim?
  179. linus as I understand it qeap wants to have phone number-based identification.
  180. qeap oky let me say i have a server and may frind have id on ather server lits make it like may id its i need a way to make may server like whatsapp aoto up loud tha contects
  181. lovetox use kontalk
  182. lovetox
  183. qeap I mean make Registration on a server that uses the phone number like whatsapp bro
  184. lovetox your server supports that already or not?
  185. lovetox a phonenumber is no difference to a normal jid
  186. qeap not
  187. qeap oky
  188. lovetox why should be a difference to
  189. lovetox what you probably want is a client who checks phonenumbers against accounts on the server
  190. lovetox only kontalk does this to my knowledge
  191. qeap hm i will c kontalk
  192. qeap that what i meen but tha problim is
  193. qeap if may frind have a id on anther server useng fhonnember
  194. qeap i need a way that make him automatically in the list of my friends
  195. qeap on may server
  196. qeap like mke whatsupp contcts show up on whatsupp app
  197. qeap i meen viber sory
  198. lovetox but whatsapp people dont have accounts on other servers do they?
  199. lovetox so all your friends can use kontalk
  200. lovetox then this works
  201. lovetox and if not, i dont think it will ever work
  202. zak In principle Jabber is not supposed to decide which contacts someone has but people should actively add friends to their contact list instead. This is a little bit more work for more control over what you want to do.
  203. qeap hm i want make a way that may users contects to ather users on anether server like may frind have id 0975452 on @bla bla show up on 0545575@km7ka roster
  204. lovetox and how should your client know on which server your friend is?
  205. lovetox could be or or
  206. qeap Incubator Network
  207. qeap like
  208. qeap
  209. qeap *SCRATCH*
  210. lovetox i dont understand what you want to say
  211. lovetox thats 2 different jids on two different servers
  212. lovetox how should your client know which to contact
  213. qeap I want to make my friend appears in the list without the need to type hes address or make hem use jid on tha server that i used
  214. qeap do y get tha idia *PARDON*
  215. qeap Set to appear in the list of my friends evin if it uses another server
  216. lovetox yeah i get what you want
  217. lovetox but you dont explain how that should work
  218. zak For that to happen you need a single one instance who knows all about people and their friends. You should use WhatsApp, it does that.
  219. lovetox you want something that even whatsapp cant do
  220. lovetox all whatsapp people are on the same server
  221. lovetox that is for a reason
  222. lovetox to make this possible
  223. qeap hm
  224. lovetox now you want the same thing without people beeing on the same server
  225. lovetox ok, but then you have to invent a way of doing this
  226. lovetox i dont know one :)
  227. qeap hahaha
  228. zak Up to now, people share their phone number (and maybe e-mail adress). What's so bad about sharing a JID as well. Phone number=voice; Mail address=longer texts with or without attachments; Jabber ID=short texts/chats
  229. zak Then everyone has everything covered.
  230. qeap need thing like that i can up loud may server data and may frind makd tha same move and make it
  231. linus You could have some central server where people register their phone number/JID and can fetch the JID for a given phone number, then write some little program that will sync contacts accordingly. It would only have to run once to populate the roster.
  232. linus but that's more complicated than just adding your friends' JIDs.
  233. lovetox yeah and then someone takes your phonenumber
  234. lovetox and then you need some administration and verification of identities
  235. lovetox and so on and on..
  236. qeap > ar2en : People are lazy do not have time to add to his list a friend
  237. zak no, people do anything they need to do if they get something for it that they want
  238. zak they create accounts everywhere on the internet, their mobile gaming consoles, for accessing their bonus point accounts and so on
  239. qeap whay piple use whatsapp
  240. linus because other people use whatsapp
  241. qeap oky what make whatsapp hav 1blion user
  242. zak It's like the scene in the Life of Brian: "We are all individuals!" :-)
  243. zak because people like to do, what other people do
  244. lovetox qeap because they were basically first to make it really easy
  245. lovetox now other messengers do the same
  246. lovetox but they will never get 1 billion
  247. qeap no
  248. qeap Because they found the friends were present without the need to ask them what is your email
  249. qeap *PARDON*
  250. lovetox but other messengers do this aswell now
  251. zak You can just use WhatsApp for those "individuals" and you can use a decent Jabber client as well for people who like to think for themselves and have a Jabber ID
  252. qeap so i want make may friend on gajim present with withot ask hem what is your email or what server y use
  253. qeap that all what i need
  254. zak It's not possible.
  255. lovetox yeah and all i need is a million dollar, qeap, why is there not a million dollar for me? why?
  256. zak @lovetox? Oh that's all? Why didn't you ask before....?
  257. zak :-D
  258. qeap hahahaha
  259. linus how about this one, I'll do it for you for 10000€
  260. qeap *ROFL*
  261. linus Not even joking :)
  262. zak I do it for 9500€ :-D
  263. linus I'm sure you could find someone to do it for less as well if you're willing to pay someone to develop it!
  264. linus If you don't want to pay, you could develop it yourself, or find someone else who wants the feature enough to pay someone to develop it, or, well, use Kontalk or WhatsApp :)
  265. linus aww, we scared him away
  266. qeap hahaha nob
  267. qeap linus: It is very difficult to scare me
  268. linus oh good
  269. linus so, are you going to accept any of our offers? ;)
  270. qeap that a big mony for soldier like me
  271. linus fair enough
  272. linus If I had unlimited time I'd definitely make it, but, well, I don't...
  273. qeap I have a kilo potatoes in a tent guard that all my fortune
  274. qeap may name is hnibal a soldier in syrian army
  275. zak And how is it going down there?
  276. linus that doesn't sound like fun
  277. qeap polits evry wher hahahaha
  278. zak polits?
  279. lovetox police maybe
  280. qeap i meen lead
  281. qeap bullets
  282. zak that is indeed not fun
  283. qeap It is not fun to be in full consciousness in the war
  284. qeap drank a can of beer before going to the fighting
  285. qeap that make it fun
  286. zak Let's hope that it comes to an end soon.
  287. hermann Hi, I'm trying to send an image from Gajim 0.16.5 (with URL_image_preview plugin 0.7.5 + OMEMO 0.9) to Android 6 with Conversations 1.3.8, but for this contact the plugin is greyed out with the mouse-over message: "this contact does not support xhtml_im" Another contact has Conversations 1.3.9 + OMEMO and it works ok. Somebody an idea what's going on? Does Android needs something extra to Conversations to make this work? Many thanks.
  288. linus hermann: how are you trying to send it? Http upload?
  289. linus Or the send file button?
  290. linus Or which plugin is greyed out?
  291. hermann "send image" is the name of the button
  292. hermann it appeared when I installed the URL_image_preview plugin
  293. linus huh, I didn't know it had that
  294. linus in any case, you'll want to use HTTP Upload to send images to conversation users. Or to anyone, really. The server has to support it though
  295. hermann I also have the http upload button, but it doesn't have a preview when I send the image
  296. hermann when I use the "send image" button, then preview works fine
  297. hermann ok, but the "send image" butten can only send small images, apparently - 90kb is too much already
  298. linus yeah, it encodes the image into the actual message so the limits are pretty tight
  299. hermann In Gajim I only see the https link when I send something instead of the image preview
  300. hermann I mean when I send it with http upload...
  301. linus then url_image_preview might not be working correctly
  302. hermann outch, I used the wrong button - file instead of image... :-$
  303. hermann now it works
  304. linus oh ok :)
  305. hermann thanks linus
  306. linus No worries
  307. hermann Just one more question regarding image preview. When I send something from Conversations (with OMEMO) to Gajim, should there be a image preview in Gajim? I only get the https link to the image in Gajim instead of the image preview.
  308. linus Only if url_image_preview is enabled and the image is small enough I believe
  309. hermann it's enabled in my Gajim and even small images don't work. Maybe it has to do with the mouse-over message "this contact does not support xhtml_im"
  310. hermann according to xhtml_im should work with Conversations "Conversations sends both. Plain body and the xhtml-im tag."
  311. linus Oh, OK. I don't know in that case
  312. linus Wait actually
  313. hermann in the config of the URL-image-prewview plug in one can configure up to 10MB in files size
  314. linus I'm not sure
  315. hermann ok, thanks anyways. maybe I follow up on Git. THere is one ticket still open on this.
  316. baitisj lovetox: FYI my solution to his problem was to point him to a server that... supported HTTP upload :D
  317. jayaura Hi, I just tried installing OMEMO plugin on Linux (Fedora 24), but I got this error:
  318. jayaura I have python-axolotl installed, and I can import it from python console
  319. jayaura python2 console, no axolotl in python3 console
  320. jayaura okay i got it fixed, i saw the "if that doesnt work" part just now
  321. lovetox good to hear jayaura :)
  322. lovetox hermann
  323. lovetox are you on linux?
  324. lovetox you have to have the python-cryptography package installed
  325. lovetox only then can image preview decrypt images in a reasonable time
  326. lovetox also im currently working on better solution
  327. lovetox so we can click the link and it opens in the explorer
  328. lovetox also like linus pointed out
  329. lovetox in the plugin config select 10 MB
  330. linus lovetox, hermann already did that I think
  331. hermann yes linux,
  332. lovetox ah yes i see
  333. lovetox so check if cryptography is installed
  334. hermann not sure about the python package
  335. hermann is it a plugin?
  336. lovetox no its a linux package
  337. lovetox what system are you on
  338. hermann mint 17
  339. lovetox search your package manager
  340. lovetox or do pip install cryptography
  341. lovetox
  342. lovetox on ubuntu there is this package
  343. linus Everyone writes linux instead of Linus x)
  344. lovetox no i asked him are you on linux
  345. hermann the old Linus is dead.... long live Linus junior...
  346. hermann I can't find it in the package manager, so I did pip install cryptography but installation seems to have failed build/temp.linux-x86_64-2.7/_openssl.c:429:30: fatal error: openssl/opensslv.h: File or Directory not found error: command 'x86_64-linux-gnu-gcc' failed with exit status 1
  347. linus install libssl-dev
  348. linus but python-cryptography should exist in mint...
  349. linus or python3-cryptography if you're on the default branch
  350. lovetox linus really nobody is on the default branch ^^
  351. linus :(
  352. lovetox sudo apt-get install build-essential libssl-dev libffi-dev python-dev
  353. lovetox thats all dependencys
  354. linus huh ok so mint doesn't have all the packages ubuntu has.
  355. linus (just saw that it is indeed not there)
  356. hermann besides the following warning, the install was successful this time Could not find .egg-info directory in install record for cryptography
  357. hermann I'll try it now
  358. hermann great, now it work 8-)
  359. hermann many thank lovetox
  360. hermann have I overlooked these install - instructions for the URL-image-preview plug-in?
  361. lovetox no not really, its very new
  362. lovetox it works also without that, just not for encrypted pictures
  363. lovetox but im working on a better solution
  364. hermann I also tried without Omemo though and it was the same. Only a https link..
  365. hermann but maybe something went wrong on my side then
  366. giorgio Hi all! I just killed gajim by installing OMEMO (at least I tried...) and can't make it work anymore.... Deinstalled and reinstalled by gui: failed deinstalled by sudo pacman -Rns gajim and rm -rf /.config/gajim Installed again Gajim still crashes by: "no module named axolotl" Any idea how I can start from scratch without plugins? Tks for your appreciated help in advance! giorgio
  367. linus giorgio: remove ~/.local/share/gajim also
  368. giorgio Tks! I'll try!
  369. linus You could also fix it by installing python-axolotl and its dependencies
  370. giorgio I'm not really a professional Linux user; playing with these kind of tools still makes me shivering...
  371. linus You don't need to be an expert. But of course if you're more comfortable and you don't need E2E encryption that's fine too :)
  372. lovetox just install python-axolotl
  373. lovetox what system are you on?
  374. lovetox to be honest i dont understand why it crashes, with the new version there should just be a error message
  375. giorgio for two three years Linuxmint, changed to Manjaro now and not really familiar with it at the moment (but it's getting better...)
  376. lovetox linus, wtf is manjaro ;:D
  377. lovetox another debian distri?
  378. giorgio Error message you can only see by starting it in a terminal...
  379. lovetox and it worked ok before?
  380. linus "Manjaro is a user-friendly GNU/Linux distribution based on the independently developed Arch Linux."
  381. lovetox so can he use AUR?
  382. linus Possibly I guess?
  383. linus I really don't know
  384. lovetox cippaciong are you there?
  385. linus I also need to sleep, see you!
  386. lovetox ca
  387. giorgio AUR is a possibility, but... as I said beginner, not professional...
  388. lovetox then install this
  389. lovetox
  390. lovetox it has all dependencys
  391. giorgio First of all, I try your advices to start from scratch, then I try to get OMEMO...
  392. lovetox i dont think you need start from scratch
  393. lovetox nothing is bad
  394. lovetox it just doesnt start because it cant find the dependency
  395. lovetox this package installs axolotl and all dependencys
  396. lovetox after that it should start
  397. giorgio It's also an excercise to get familiar with the system...
  398. giorgio some things ar slightly different to mint (makes me unsure) and I'm not deep in the materia, lets call it this way: An old bloke that wants to know...
  399. lovetox yeah let me know how you are doing
  400. cippaciong giorgio: you should be able to install gajim-plugin-omemo from aur even if you are using Manjaro
  401. cippaciong
  402. giorgio Tks for hint; last removing/installing of gajim failed too...
  403. giorgio Will try it now...
  404. cippaciong Keeping removing/installing gajim is useless. You are simply removing and restoring the same files
  405. cippaciong Plugins are installed in ~/.local/share/gajim and that folder will persist across different uninstall/install processes
  406. giorgio even by trying it with: rm -rf /.local/share/gajim? (As mentioned by linus above)
  407. cippaciong To install the plugin from aur you will have to use either an aur helper like yaourt (which I personally don't like that much) or, if you want to understand how aur works, install it by hand with makepkg, in that case you will have to fetch other aur dependencies (like python2-axolotl-git) manually
  408. cippaciong What if your error exactly?
  409. cippaciong What is your error exactly?
  410. giorgio "No module named axolotl.ecc.djbec" is first one, "No module named axolotl last one... I'm not that good to install software by hand, I need somebody to show me an answers my silly questions, and, of course it isn't the time to call friends now... (long ago friends were reachable at this time, now everybody has familiy and phonecalls at this time causes problems...)
  411. lovetox ignore the last one
  412. lovetox its the same reason
  413. lovetox axolotl is not installed
  414. giorgio I know...
  415. giorgio still reading and trying to understand "how to"...